Brewdog using @ratebeer in National Media

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Nice! Overall score is finally useful :slight_smile:

Suggests that BrewDog appreciates that point estimates often have large associated confidence intervals.

Wow. Twitter people are very very very very angry all the time.

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This is certainly good for RateBeer. Maybe a wild stab at InBev and RateBeer’s relationship but they’re doing a favor by pushing our authority. I love the full page ad, but I wonder if comparing themselves to very mass market beers at much lower price points is really what BrewDog intends?

This brings to mind the new Brewers Association campaign “Independence you can taste” that rolled out today. There are now several distinct tiers of brewers. 1) Beers made for beer connoisseurs, that are often sold in tap rooms, or at special releases often at the richest price points and brew for highest quality, 2) Regional craft beers that are no longer at mom and pop scale but aim for a recognizably craft product and are reasonably nimble and serves mostly craft consumers 3) International craft that is largely mimicking, compete with and have major business advantages over the first two tiers and serves a more casual customer and produces mostly beer that doesn’t quite taste like the first two tiers 4) mostly Big Beer which serves the largest market and has the greatest business advantages and sells beer that, at best, approaches tier 3 beers in quality.

This “independence you can taste” then doesn’t seem to make sense at all, and seems to be a challenge that a Founders, Wicked Weed, Firestone Walker or Beavertown might readily take up against many of the tier 3 or tier 4 brewers (Pabst is craft and “independent” by the Brewers Associations rules) flying the Independent badge, that aren’t really in the tier 1 or tier 2 game. Is it really good or bad for small producers to have their quality standards compared to million barrel international breweries that have shifted to brewing beers for a casual or mass market consumer?

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Not always highest quality. Lots of cheap stabs taken to get money.

More generally speaking, the market place is crowded and competitive. The BA is trying to differentiate their products from “crafty” brewers since the typical consumer can’t tell. Their goal is to serve their members. It is not a perfect system but generally does do the trick, more so than not. For the fanatical consumer (e.g., RBians) all the labeling in the world doesn’t make a difference. Simply put: for the average consumer, the little bottle icon may make a big difference.

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Probably not a bad thing, BD have some influence, better to have them on side than not.

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I don’t think anyone has made that claim yet that it really does anything positive for sales. New Glarus for instance is among the most independent and craft of craft brewers and Deb Carey has said that it almost certainly doesn’t do anything for them.

But really the bigger question is if it’s harmful to small craft brewers who are largely up against other small craft brewers primarily, but then their next #2 set of competitors are large craft that may use the Independent mark. Mega craft brewers have a ton of distribution, marketing, production, source contract and other advantages over small craft, but the BA stamp is really equating them in the eyes of consumers. If the intent is to help small craft, the stamp is probably hurting them more than it’s helping them.

Absolutely!

You have to bear in mind that in the UK craft beer doesn’t really exist yet. When Brew dog placed that ad it was for the 99% of the population that doesn’t drink craft beer, and cannot name more than 10 breweries in general. They will buy their beer from a supermarket and if Brewdog can successfully claim to have a superior beer than the other brewery on that shelf in the supermarket, then that’s all that matters.

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Awesome take on this Joe, thanks for sharing.

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I don’t see a problem here really. In fact I don’t see how can large national breweries compete with smaller local breweries. Why would someone pick national IPA which has been in store for God knows how long over quality fresh local IPA?

Price? Maybe, but how much beer you have to drink to really feel the difference in cost?

Also my understanding is that statistics support my theory. I’m not from USA so I may be wrong but my understanding was national breweries are the craft segment which has been taking hits recently, not doing that well.

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Nice to see Ratebeer used in this way IMO.

They do say some nice things about RB in their blog here -

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Those are all good points. I think you’re right about how this will play out. The campaign seems to aim at causing confusion between million hectoliter craft brewers and 1000 hectoliter craft brewers. And both of these compete for the same shelf space.

Small - competes with small and megcraft
Large craft - competes with Big Beer and small craft
Big beer - competes with large craft

So yes, large craft is doing very well in some areas but not others. So the trade organization here is changing the focus of what craft beer was (formerly small, independent and traditional) to be entirely about independence in order to obfuscate size. This means to create an advantage for the very large craft brewers as they fight against the small. The campaign primarily benefits very large craft brewers.

Why should there be a confusion? Could someone confuse Sierra Nevada being small like Other Half or Monkish?

The way I see it purpose of this campaign is pretty much the same like the purpose of defining craft beer. In my view it’s separating the “good” and “bad” guys. The bad guys here are the breweries so large that they can play out the free market rules. Free market, supply and demand can take care of rest. And as I mentioned that seems to be happening. Craft national breweries are in decline and small local quality breweries are thriving.

Also I do have some reserves about the shelf space we’re talking about. I’d say national craft is fighting for shelf space with big beer. I don’t think that’s the same shelf space small breweries are looking for. Or at least overlapping between national craft and big beer shelf space is way bigger than national and small craft. Of course this is from my perspective which may not be necessarily correct.

If you think about it, only RB makes sense to be used as a hammer here. BA scale would rate Bud Light and stuff too high, like at 38% for the pDev score, which is too high. Whereas at RB we ruthlessly shit on it and give it a 0% percentile. For marketing purposes this is great. I feel RB should hype the worst beers list and expand it.

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Ab Inbev strikes back!

I’d love to see a country-based breakdown of active RB users as of 2018.

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Id love to see one of those surveys they do in companies to see how happy people are. As i bet satisfaction with RB has tumbled in the last year.

I like the new forums but for rating wise im struggling to think of any change that i would consider positive
and there so much i hatefrom the new seatch to the the scroll down load a little more shit. that keeps sticking makes it imposible to goto the end, to the showing unwanted txt where all we really want is who had it and possible what score they gave

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In the same vein, I’ve just noticed that Hoppin’ Frog gave pride of place to the distinctions on RateBeer…

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